Israel - Rabbis Get Female-Free Flight
Israel - Two leading rabbis concluded an agreement with El Al, and bought all first class tickets, and asked the airliner to only post male stewards on the flight so they do not have to see women on their way to America, also to have it movie-free.
The two rabbis are the Gerrer Rebbe and Rabbi Aharon Leib Steinman, 93, who will fly to visit American Jewish communities.
The rabbis asked that the flight from Israel adhere to the strictest standards of modesty. Their aides agreed with El Al officials that they will not have to see women during flight.
They bought all first class tickets on the flight to make sure no businesswomen are on board.
It was also decided that no films will be screened during the flight. Moreover, the backs of first class seats will be covered with plastic so that the rabbis won't even have to see the television screens.
Responding to the report, El Al said: "We do not report on our costumers out of respect for their privacy."
posted by VOS IZ NEIAS @ 5/09/2006 10:07:00 AM
7 Comments:
At 2:30 PM,
Anonymous said…
I SPOKE TO A WEEL KNOWN GERRER CHUSID AND HE SAID IT IN NOT TRUE
THE REBBE IS COMMING W BRITISH AIRWAYS TO LOS ANGELES THIS COMMING SUNDAY
CHECK IT OUT NOT TO BE MOITZE SHEM RA
At 5:56 PM,
Anonymous said…
I hope you're right, b/c this sounds rediculous.
I can see asking not have female flight attendants, but to cover the screens, so that the TV dissappears. Talk about putting your head in the sand!
At 8:30 PM,
Anonymous said…
MABY THEY SHOULD PUT THEM IN A BIG BOX SO IT WILL SOLVE ALL THE PROBLEMS
At 8:58 AM,
Anonymous said…
I know of know of many gedoilei Yisruel who traveled on airplanes without all these precautions. Either way, I don't see what kind of moitze shem ra this is.
At 1:38 PM,
Anonymous said…
i think they should ban females from the airports as well. this way the rabbis won't have to see women before their departure and after their arrival. if there has to be a woman in an airport, she should put a bag over her head.
At 3:10 PM,
Anonymous said…
actually reb tzvi meir did the same thing when he went to america last year...
At 1:02 PM,
Anonymous said…
Several Saudi newspapers, including the English-language Arab News and the Saudi Gazette, carried stories yesterday about a woman who was allegedly "humiliated" at Munich airport.
The elderly woman, dressed in full hijab, had been to Germany for medical reasons and was on her way back to Saudi Arabia when a female airport official asked her to uncover her face for a security check.
"The inspector turned a deaf ear to all my pleas and started yelling at me," al-Watan newspaper quoted the Saudi woman as saying. "Under her insistence, I requested her to conduct the inspection in a separate room. At this point she started insulting and mocking me, telling me that this is Germany."
According to the woman, the official continued: "Who do you think you are? You are no one here. You stupid mop. You will uncover your head and I will search your hair piece by piece."
That's certainly an offensive way to behave, but we only have woman's word that it happened. Airport officials may well have another version of events but the Saudi reports don't tell us what it is, nor do they name the woman who complained.
The Religious Policeman blog has a different take on the story, suggesting that the woman's behaviour was ridiculous. Having gone on a medical visit to Germany she apparently had no qualms about letting doctors examine whatever parts of her anatomy were causing the problem, so why object to a female security official seeing her face?
Meanwhile, there's an intriguing tale about two prominent Jewish rabbis who will be flying from Israel to the US on Sunday to do a spot of charitable fund-raising. They are of the Haredi persuasion which, as I have noted before, is remarkably similar to Saudi Wahhabism in its attitude to sex and gender.
In accordance with arrangements made for the two men, the plane will have no female flight attendants. The rabbis bought out all the first class tickets in order to avoid seeing businesswomen on the flight. Only men will care for the passengers. No movies will be screened, nor will the TV monitors be visible; El Al agreed to cover the screens on the backs of the first class seats with plastic.
How considerate of El Al. And presumably charitable donors in the US won't mind knowing that large sums of money have already been blown on first class seats just to keep women out of sight. Ludicrous as they may be in the eyes of many people, both these stories raise some serious questions about the interface between religious practices and the rest of the world.
My own starting point on this is that we must respect the beliefs of others. Everyone has a right to their beliefs. If they believe that the earth is flat they are entitled to think so and, if they wish, to try to persuade me that it's true. Equally, I have the right to argue that they're wrong. If neither of us can convince the other, though, we have to leave it at that without resorting to the methods of the Spanish inquisition.
Practices based on belief (as opposed to beliefs themselves) take us into more difficult territory, however. If someone's beliefs require them to eat fish on Friday or to have sex with their clothes on, I really don't mind about that unless they try to impose it on other people too. Sometimes, though, two different sets of practices come up against each other and one side or the other has to give way.
A few years ago I boarded a plane at Tel Aviv airport, bound for London and a Jewish woman who had been allocated the seat next to me objected on the grounds that her beliefs forbade her to sit next to a man. Since the plane was completely full and I'm not fussy about where I sit, I told the stewardess I would be willing to move if she could find a female passenger to swap places with me. This she did, and as I left my seat a man in conservative Jewish dress sitting nearby looked up and said: "Thank you very much for that. A lot of people would have refused."
Since then, a few people have told me I should have stayed put, but I really don't know. It didn't matter at all to me one way or the other, though it clearly did matter a lot to the woman who had been placed next to me.
On another occasion, I was meeting a group of Muslims for dinner in London. Someone introduced me to a young woman who I had never met before and I held out my hand. "I don't shake hands," she said firmly.
"OK then, I'd better just say hello."
Since that incident, I have got into the habit of waiting to see if a Muslim woman holds out her hand when I meet her before offering mine. It avoids any embarrassment but it's also a concession and in a way signifies acceptance of a system that discriminates between men and women.
Visiting the Middle East regularly for work, I come across minor dilemmas of this kind quite often. Generally, I take the view that travellers should adapt as far as possible to local practices: when in Riyadh do as the Riyadhis do. Not that I'm always comfortable about it, though. Sitting in the men-only section of a Saudi cafe or restaurant, I sometimes wonder how it differs from the whites-only places they used to have in South Africa, and how I would have felt about being there.
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/brian_whitaker/2006/05/compromise_or_collusion.html
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